254 Righter's Mill Road, Gladwyne
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We have just discovered the various blog postings on your website concerning development of the Winter property, and we are writing to correct statements attributed to us and published by SAC under its own name and Doran249. Doran249 found us through genealogy sources and began an email correspondence with us concerning the family and our knowledge of the property. The posting by SAC on November 13, 2006, is a direct quote of one of our emails to him. That genealogy information is already online and available to anyone with a computer and the wit to search for it, but it was obviously submitted by Doran249 and then published, without our permission. On December 5, 2006, you published a blog entitled “Historical Significance of 254 Righters Mill Rd.” submitted by Doran249. In the third paragraph, Doran gives Winter family information, naming us as the source. That information is grossly incorrect. His errors, not ours, and again, published without our permission. Unfortunately, the Stirk family now believes that the entire blog is a quote from us when it is actually Doran’s interpretation of Winter/Stirk family history and the property. We thought we had made it quite plain to Doran that we had no wish to become involved in the hearings and certainly did will not join in any protests. We are still wondering how the problem was eventually resolved; had we known of your website, we might have monitored this earlier. In the December posting, both the incorrect family information and Doran’s opinions have caused considerable stress to us and, apparently, to the Stirk family – for good reason! A family rift may have been created here where none has existed and where none should be. We can only hope that Mrs. Clinton Stirk and her daughter, Susan, will understand our dismay. Eugene and Anna Winter had five grandsons whose families are the descendents of the Winter legacy in Gladwyne. Now, with Clinton gone, Bill is the only grandson still living. We sincerely hope that our two families can rise above this and share family information and memories. Doran249 and others who submit opinions for publication should remember that they have no right to quote someone else, correctly or incorrectly, for publication, nor to publish identification and an address without permission from the original writer. You have said “bloggers have a right to their opinions.” That may be so, but they do not have a right to imply that others agree with them. Thanks for this opportunity to set things right. J. William and Marjorie B. Winter, New Bern, NC Bookmark/Search this post with: |
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Well hello there, having a bad day or e-mail correspondent's remorse a year later? What are you in a lather about precisely? That your geneology is out there more on the web than it was before? Are e-mails proprietary? Did you say your e-mails were proprietary? Did you say do not forward or republish? Unless you did, what is wrong other than a bad case of sour grapes? The information about your family that came from you was attributed to you if we recall, but you were hardly the sole source were you?
If any of the information is incorrect, perhaps it is based upon incorrect information which you provided on your family? And we posted about the house as well as the folks themselves in Gladwyne...and lest we forget the media wrote about the family and house, so this is who's fault why? Who did you say you corresponded with? You are fighting with your relatives up here, or they are fighting with you? That sounds kinda personal. All we and others were trying to do was preserve a historic house in a locally, federally and state recognized historic district. A home we might add, that , your extended family members felt they had no choice but to sell. No one has attacked your family, and what you wrote in those e-mails you have also previously published on geneology websites, have you not?
Your family geneology is in a few books, on the web for public perusal, and in newspaper articles here and there. So they can be researched innumerable ways including your e-mails, your e-mails which did not contain any sort of legal disclaimer.
If you are going to stir up a tempest in a blogspot, consider all of the above.
We're sorry you are upset, but in the future, you need to be specific when corresponding with folks and posting on the web. We also feel it is a bit of a stretch to be blaming outsiders for what seems like a family squabble. And just for the record if you researched the posts on 254, we were very kind to Susan Stirk March and her family. We would have loved their input on the home, but they chose not to engage, but you did. So why is that our fault, and why on earth would your relatives or far flung family members take issue with what you said anyway? Did you mention axe murderers and criminals? No, you told of an interesting family history. Again, that is personal between you and them. Truly we are sorry for your trouble, but your beef and their beef is personal. It has nothing to do with us.
The history of your family was/is integral to saving this historic house and is integral and oft discussed in conjunction with the history of Gladwyne, and we are stunned at your reaction. We would have thought your family would have been thrilled that the community cared enough about your ancestral home to go out and try to save it. It's all quite odd and petty, actually, and we are wondering if this ever occured at Mt. Vernon or Monticello.
Thanks for writing. It's been an education, and to refresh your memory, here are the e-mails, and what you said specifically - if you recall you were contacted randomly when people were searching out more history on the home in efforts to save it:
AND
and
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permalinkIt absolutely AMAZES me how people in Lower Merion "think" they are experts on my family, my ancestors and the history of my parents' former home at 254 Righters Mill Road. I am sorry to disappoint you but there is NO riff between my family and our relatives in North Carolina. There are no sour grapes. Unless your last name happens to be Stirk and you ever lived at 254 Righters Mill Road, you are NOT an authority on our family.
As a Stirk and former resident of 254 Righters Mill Road, I would just like to state for the record that I could care less what happens to the buildings that are currently on the property. Nothing of historical significance ever occured there. George Washington NEVER slept there. What is the BIG deal?
I hate to point this out to you but in time ALL buildings in the United States will be old enough to be classified as historic. What do you propose? Never tear ANYTHING down? I can see fighting to preserve a building of historic significance. However, as I said before, nothing like that ever took place there. Face it. Its time has come.
The dwellings at 254 Righters Mill Road served their purpose as homes to my family and our ancestors. However, we have all moved on and the new owner has his own ideas of what to do with the property.
Time marches on and you cannot stop progress.
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permalink"Time marches on and you cannot stop progress."
Oh Susan why are you so bitter? And if there is no family squabble, what is up with your relative's post indicating there is a squabble? No one pretends to be an authority on your family, we go on what your family members have told us. You should be more proud and less bitter of your past, as your family was part of the fabric that formed Gladwyne in a certain time. And we think your family home is very cool, as well as being a great example of Lower Merion's Victorian era.
We are sorry you are so angry, but you need to look within yourself and solve it.
Your family home might not have hosted George Washington, but it is historically significant. Too bad you can't appreciate it more, or at least be in a better place to accept that the world is not your enemy. And yes, that is what comes through: that you are very bitter and very angry at the world.
Ok, your family wanted to sell out and move on when your father died, that is kind of natural. But don't you dare be so obnoxious about how your neighbors and others feel about preservation and 254 Righters Mill Road. And if the new owner had presented a better plan from jump, would any of us be having the continual conversations about 254 Righters Mill Road?
Whatever. Thanks again for posting. You are of course, welcome at any time to post about your family history and what it was like growing up in Gladwyne. We're sorry for whatever your trouble is. Truly.
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permalinkHere is the source of my aggravation:
For 5 generations, the Winter/Stirk families owned 254 Righters Mill Road. They were wonderful, hard-working, civic-minded individuals whom I am extremely proud to call my relatives. In 2005, it became necessary for my parents to sell the property due to my father's poor health. As he was dying, he continued to maintain the upkeep of the property as best he could. In fact, he passed away in 2006 from cancer.
I read a posting on the SAC website in which my father was accused of INTENTIONALLY neglecting the upkeep at 254. Here was a person who did not KNOW my family at all nor the circumstances involved and yet they felt compelled to insult my deceased father. It is my humble opinion that a person should NOT make such accusations unless they know ALL the FACTS.
Then over time, I have read countless articles in the Main Line Times regarding the new owner of 254 and his plans for the property. One individual, who writes a column for the newspaper, stated absolutely INCORRECT information for the world to read, worded his article in a derogatory manner AND used an insulting adjective to describe my family. Considering this person NEVER met any of my family members, I was extremely angry to see this in print in the local newspaper. It is beyond words what it is like to read erroneous information about your family in the newspaper and to have them insulted on top of it. You wonder why I am bitter? How would you feel if lies were being printed in the newspaper about YOUR family?
I would like to know why my family is being targeted in the newspaper and having terrible lies written about them like they are the bad guys in all of this. As I stated before, Mom and Dad were two elderly individuals whose declining health led them to sell their home. That is ALL!
The point I am trying to make is, my elderly parents had a property to sell, they sold it and all heck has broken out over what the NEW owner wants to do with the place. It is nothing more than a piece of land which consists of tons of DIRT. On that dirt, are three buildings, one of which is over 100 + years old. There is nothing special about this building other than it is old. It has NO historical significance. It is just an old building made of wood. I don't understand why people are spending so much time and energy fighting over this old building when there are FAR more important issues in the world to worry about.
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permalinkDear Susan,
You mentioned before how people felt about how your father kept up the property. Now, there have been so many articles in more than one newspaper written about 254 Righters Mill Road, and editorials as well (including from SAC Members), but honestly, we don't remember anyone slamming your father and his maintenance of the property. But you sure do talk about it a lot, don't you?
The simple fact is this: Victorians are a bear to keep up. Your dad did the best he could at a time when he was sick and then dying. Hindsight is 20-20 as they say, and could he have done a better job or should he have done a better job? Well we don't consider that to be our business. Now some SAC members know people who rented from your dad, but those people have never posted about the living conditions. That is their story to tell.
You view the historic home that was built by your ancestors/family members as a "piece of land and tons of dirt". That's sad, but it is your opinion. Just like everyone else is allowed to have an opinion.
Your family has never been targeted for discussion by anyone other than for the appreciation of the home and their part in the history of Gladwyne....And your family members told people freely of your extended family history and then had storyteller's remorse it seems..again, not of our doing.
Your parents sold the property because no one could afford to keep it any longer and your dad was dying, right? The Montgomery County Real Estate Records record a property transfer on 31-MAY-06 for $800,000 between STIRK J CLINTON and RIGHTCOR LP with date recorded of 18-JUL-06 on Parid 40-00-49876-00-7 . Those are the facts, right?
Now it seems that your birthplace overall has nothing but unhappy memories for you? We're sorry for your troubles. But you have to understand something, and maybe you don't since you no longer live in Lower Merion: residents who have lived here a lifetime or close to it are finding their neighborhoods being supersized into parcels of ugliness (you grew up in Gladwyne, take a drive down Waverly Rd to Sweetbriar and Briar Hill Roads somethime), our elderly and others of more moderate income are being forced out because they can't afford any of the taxes - and a lot of these taxes are directly attributable to the Hamptonization of the Main Line - the artificially inflated real estate market, developers tearing down average and historic homes and rebuilding / replacing with Garage Mahals and McMansions.
The neighborhood in which you grew up, one which you obviously have no affinity for, is tired of this trend. And they jumped through hoops to become a local, state, and national historic district. They slaved under HARB standards based upon the Secretary of the Interior's standards for years, restoring their homes at great expense and playing by the rule, the proposed development of this property was like a cruel joke on them.
And it is a shame that you can't see the historic significance of where you were born. No one is slamming your family, although we do know that there are former tenants out there who have very personal thoughts on the condition of the house and the rent they paid because they lived there with your dad as a landlord . And you can get your skirts in a bunch over that if you choose, but remember, it is only a comment, not an accusation. It isn't good, bad, or indiffierent, merely a comment.
Your parents sold your family home. That was their right as property owners. However, the neighbors of 254 Righters Mill Road have property rights too. And it is their right to protest the proposed, or what was the proposed development of 254 Righters Mill Rd. (Hard to say what happens next since the certificate of appropriateness was denied)
You don't get historic and neighborhood preservation, and you appear to be one angry woman.
Prior to this, we all appreciated your family history and contributions to the history of Gladwyne. Now in addition, we just wonder: why is it that the current generations of the Stirk Winter family are so angy?
No one denied your parents property rights Susan. But there is irony in the fact that you surface now. If you were so keen on getting the history right, etc, where were you a year ago? Or are you being vocal now because the new owner of 254 Righters Mill Road is unhappy and is that affecting you for some reason?
You have drawn your OWN target on your family, and it seems when it comes to your family, you are making others responsible for your own issues and why is that?
No one has demonized your deceased father or your mom, other than you. We hope you work through your bitterness and anger, but it seems very deep seeded...and not of anyone's doing recently...and we have reread the articles, editorial, and letters to the editor read by MANY people MALE and FEMALE in more than one newspaper. And we've re-read the SAC posts and don't know what you are talking about. And had you come to a SAC meeting ever Susan, or attended any of the public meetings, you might have discovered people who you indeed might have remembered, who never had an unkind word to say about you. But instead, you just vent your spleen.
Once again, you have to understand something: your family was only discussed within the parameters of being part of the history of 254 Righters Mill Road. No one is slamming your parents for not being able to afford to keep the family house any longer, they are but one of many who faced the same difficult decision. No one slammed your father for being a less than perfect landlord --- You have dragged that all out and aired your personal laundry with regard to that right here.
So if people are talking, they are talking Susan because they are wondering, as stated before, what the world did to you to make you so angry and bitter? And if you are worried about people perceiving your family in a negative manner, then consider how people are taking your posts, in which you are the one doing the attacking...not anyone else.... seriously, you are doing the attacking you accuse everyone else of. If people are talking, it is because YOU have given them something to talk about.
Life is what you make of it, and you can't blame the world for everything. Thank you again, for writing and your interpretation of things. You'll understand if we reserve final judgement, won't you? And remember the old adage: Least said, soonest mended. If you want the chatter to stop with regard to the slights you perceive upon your family, stop providing additional chatter fodder, because right now as it stands you actually seem to have more to say then the man your father sold the property too, the actual property owner of record at this point in time....you see wood and dirt, others see history. Not everyone sees things the same way, which is what makes like interesting, huh?
It's a beautiful day. Go take a walk and clear your head. Appreciate what life has to offer you.
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